Okay, before we get underway, here’s the Greek text, for those of you who read Greek and would like to glance through the passage:
1 Timothy 2:11-12
11 γυνὴ ἐν ἡσυχίᾳ μανθανέτω ἐν πάσῃ ὑποταγῇ·
12 ⸂διδάσκειν δὲ γυναικὶ⸃ οὐκ ἐπιτρέπω, οὐδὲ αὐθεντεῖν ἀνδρός, ἀλλ’ εἶναι ἐν ἡσυχίᾳ.
When you look at verse 12, you see the word αὐθεντεῖν. If you follow the link I embedded, there, you’ll see last week’s post which summarizes the scholar Cynthia Long Westfall’s translation of what that word means. Her conclusion, after exhaustive research, defines ‘authentein’ as “to use or possess unrestricted force or power.”
Now, as a second year student in Greek (not an expert), looking at the text, here’s what I see, as I translate it:
11 (a woman | in | quiet disposition | let her learn | in | all | willing arrangement under)
A woman is to learn in quiet disposition, in a full and willing arrangement of herself under [the instructor, or perhaps under the instruction].
This word, ὑποταγῇ, there at the end of verse 11, is a form of what’s translated as “submission,” but doesn’t mean in Koine Greek what that word has come to mean in English. In Koine Greek it always carries a sense of willingness, and of cooperation, making ourselves receptive and available to, placing ourselves under the protection of, sometimes.
In this case, it’s describing how a woman is to be in the classroom—being of a quiet disposition, and willingly receptive to and cooperative with the teacher and what’s being taught.
The part people often miss is that Paul wanted women in the classroom, learning scripture, theology, Greek and Hebrew, reading and writing, and presumably teaching and evangelizing, right alongside the men.
Just sit with that for a minute.
Paul wanted everyone, all believers, to have seminary courses, and to become fully equipped, fully mature, lacking in nothing, when it came to handling the scriptures. Interestingly, not everyone in Paul’s day felt they needed that—for example, people who already thought they had all the necessary training and learning. (I’ll get to that in about three weeks, stay tuned, that’s Dr. A. Nyland’s compelling work on this chapter.)
Here’s the next verse:
12 (To teach | and/but | to a woman/wife | not | I am yielding to OR I yield to OR I would/may yield to | nor | [to possess unrestricted force or power] | of/over a man/husband | but rather | to be | in | quiet disposition.)
And, I would not yield to a woman (or wife) to teach nor possess unrestricted force over a man (or husband), but to be in quiet disposition.
I came across a surprise (to me) when I was working on the translation. The Greek Word Study Tool I was using gave me this for one of the words:
“ἐπιτρέπω
(Show lexicon entry in LSJ Middle Liddell Slater Autenrieth) (search)
| ἐπιτρέπω | verb 1st sg pres ind act | |
| ἐπιτρέπω | verb 1st sg pres subj act |
This word, ἐπιτρέπω, in the middle of the verse, could be what Koine Greek grammar has as “present indicative,” which means I am doing this right now.
OR it could be “present subjunctive,” meaning it’s possible I do this, but it’s also possible I don’t. It’s in the “possibilities” box. It’s still hypothetical.
Here’s an example I got from grammarly, “We asked that he listen carefully to the directions.” It’s a suggestion for something to happen, but it isn’t actually happening, at the moment. Chances are it will happen. But, then again, it might not. It’s in the “possibilities” box. It’s still hypothetical.
Also, there are a ton of possible definitions for this word!
To overturn upon, turn over, transfer, bequeath, commit, entrust, leave it to, rely upon, leave to, entrust to, give up, yield, permit, suffer, give away, indulge, command.
Are you thinking what I’m thinking? That’s a lot of interpretation to choose “permit” or “suffer” instead of, say, “leave to” or “indulge.” A LOT of interpretation.
Okay , you Greek experts! Can we get to the bottom of this?
Also, there seems to be some idiomatic definitions surrounding the clause “not/nor” that might make it more emphatic? Like, “I would clearly not…nor” or “I would most certainly not…nor”? Would love to have you all weigh in on that.
What this second verse means is where we’ll camp out today, with Marg Mowczko.
First, here is how she interprets this verse 12 (I completely recommend you read the blog attached to that embedded link. I learned a lot, and it only took me about five minutes. Plus, you will get her very convincing reasons and translation/interpretation of the strange verses following this one, vv13-15.)
But I am not allowing a woman to teach (a heretical version of Genesis 2-3) nor to bully her husband (by denying him sex because of false notions of piety).
Marg Mowczko, “AN INTERPRETATION OF 1 TIMOTHY 2:12 THAT JOINS THE DOTS OF 2:11-15“
Mowczko has also spent a good deal of time researching the word αὐθεντεῖν. This time, the embedded link leads back to her technical analysis on ‘authenteo’ words, keying in on their meaning and usage during Paul’s time.
Many Bible translations will give ‘authentein’ some form of the word “authority” in its meaning, and it does seem, at first glance, that would make sense. After all, the Greek transliteration of the word and the English word look awfully similar, don’t they? Often there is a correlation like that between Koine Greek and modern English words, but not always. I’ve been fooled more than once trying to make that be an overarching rule while trying to memorize my Greek vocabulary words.
The word that means authority in the way you and I understand it in English is the Greek “exousia.” Paul used that word often enough in his other letters. He only used ‘authentein’ once, in this letter, in this verse, which already alerts us he meant something specific. In fact, this is the only place in the whole Bible ‘authentein’ shows up, and for the longest time, Bible scholars had to rely on “best guess” based on the context to figure out what Paul was saying, because the word itself was rarely seen anywhere else in ancient Greek texts.
In any case, Mowczko found that right around the 1st to 2nd centuries A.D., the meaning of ‘authentein’ was evolving into the sense of perpetrator or mastermind, from an earlier meaning that involved murder. A related noun, “authentia” was also coined around this time, that seems to have meant “sovereignty” or “absolute power.”
Mowczko did a deep dive with eight texts that contain the infinitive form ‘authentein,’ since that’s the exact word in 1 Timothy 2:12. It makes for some excellent reading, and her writing is very readable—she has the rare gift of making scholarly work engaging and accessible to regular people like you and me. And what she found, I think, is gripping.
I’ll give you her sum-up, in her words, but really, it will only take you a few minutes to read her research:
authenteō could have the sense of being powerful (P.Herc 220), of being the author (Aristronicus), of using force (BGU 1208), of rulership and dominance (in astrological texts), of self-determination or acting on one’s own (Moeris), and perhaps of murdering someone (scholion on Eumenides).
Belleville sums up and states that the meaning of the verb authenteō in Koine Greek is “to dominate, to get one’s way.” [Belleville, “Teaching and Usurping Authority,” 216.]
Marg Mowczko, “THE MEANING OF AUTHENTEIN IN 1 TIMOTHY 2:12, WITH A BRIEF HISTORY OF AUTHENT– WORDS”
In her final summary, Mowczko quotes Cynthia Long Westfall from her 2016 book, “Paul and Gender,” with the conclusion ‘authentein’ means to override another’s will by force, in ways that could harm them, in order to serve the agent’s self-interests. She also points out the often de-emphasized fact that Paul was speaking of “a woman” not “women.” Was he referring to a specific woman? Was he speaking in the abstract? Did he mean a wife with her husband?
In her footnotes, (look for number [49]) Marg Mowczko offers an intriguing theory that would make sense in light of Gnostic teachings then starting to gain traction in Ephesus and possibly also Corinth. (for more on this theory, read her provocative treatise, “3 REASONS WHY IT’S A WOMAN, NOT ALL WOMEN, IN 1 TIMOTHY 2:12.”)
Marg Mowczko also wrote a much shorter blog called, “Authentein (in 1 Timothy 2:12), In a Nutshell,” which provides about a half dozen different sources for ‘authentein’ definitions. If you need a quick resource, this one’s great.
Having now spent some significant time with ‘authentein,’ and having established a convincingly dependable definition for this word, we’ll spread out to the chapter as a whole, with Jeremiah Vance’s chiastic model, before drawing back in to look more closely at the remaining verses.
Liber ethicorum des Henricus de Alemannia I Laurentius de Voltolina [Public domain]
All I got from this was “my opinion, my opinion, my opinion”. The text is clear and women can NOT get over that fact. Verse’s 13 and 14 ” for Adam was first formed,THEN Eve (verse 13). And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in transgression (verse 14). You clearly (like most people who are claim to be Christians, if your even a Christian at all) love to show all this “research” and how well you’ve claimed to of dove into the verses but you contradict yourselves EVERYTIME. First off, if Paul WAS talking about a specific woman he’d of mentioned it…. the scriptures are Gods word and are very plain and simple, so by pointing out that “who and what woman was Paul talking about and that only a certain woamn and not all women” again shows your ignorance and clearly you twist scripture to appease your own narrative. Again Adam was formed first and then Eve…. women were made to be helpers for man, this isn’t a sexist remark or statement….. it’s truth…. Genesis states it plain and simple. You guys are clearly mad at biology thats the issue here….. There’s other things you guys can help out with in the church but teaching…. no…. cause clearly you guys are twisting and many of you do this with 1 Timothy 4:11-15 A LOT! It’s literally as bad as homosexuals twisting Leviticus and 1 Corinthians 6 about homosexuals actually not being in the Bible…. sorry but yes it is…. I’ve studdied and dove into the Greek and Hebrew just as well. So in the end if any person (to be fair) gets up on the stand and teaches and yet they twist scripture to either fit they’re own narrative, pervert Gods word, lead people astray, and/ or to pretty much rewrite what the actual scriptures saying….. then you should NOT be up on that stage…. PERIOD. You lady are a false teacher and I rebuke you and any other person that perverts and twists God’s word to appease your own lusts and your people turn from the truth and turn unto fables (2 Timothy 4:3-5). There’s a lot of women in the world that understand this plain and simple…. why can’t you? Oh right….. you hate men and think you deserve and are entitled to everything just as much…. doesn’t work that way. Also I’ll leave with one more point…. if women we’re ok to teach…. then why weren’t there any female disciples? I’ll tell you why… again… Adam was formed first and the Eve…. again the text is saying women aren’t to teach. Oh and if you think that there were female disciples…. then I feel bad for how iggnorant you people truly are.
Thank you for taking time to send your thoughts on this passage. There are quite a few scholars who have spent a great deal of time and thought on this one passage, and have landed both on the side I speak from and the side you speak from. The general tone of your note tells me this is also an emotional issue for you, you are quite passionate in your presentation–in fact, you come across to me as rather heated. I understand. If only more people felt as passionate about spiritual matters, the things of God.
Here are two books that address the ordination of women. One book, “Crispina and Her Sisters,” comes from an archaeological perspective. The author examined the new evidence that has been unearthed in the past sixty or so years that reveals how many women were considered clergy in the early church. Women were deacons and elders, they pastored, preached, and taught. But with the coming of Constantine in the fourth century, high status men began to join the church and they could not abide having women leaders, even though the Jesus and the apostles had included women from the beginning. Culturally, for these men, such a departure from the Greco-Roman norm was untenable. So, the Order of Widows, which Paul had himself set up, was disbanded, memorials to women leaders were dismantled, and women were silenced.
The other book is written by a lawyer, judge, and theologian. He has taken meticulous care in going through the language and archaeology of each of the passages traditionally used to silence and contain women. Though I could choose from a wide array of well-respected theologians who address these issues, Andrew Bartlett is among the most thorough, particularly with this passage.
It is a difficult task to read material that challenges cherished beliefs, so I understand if you feel resistant to the suggestion. Nevertheless, I leave these two books here for you to consider.
Here’s the link to “Crispina,” https://www.amazon.com/Crispina-Her-Sisters-Authority-Christianity/dp/1506411886?crid=PLRRU3QU3DGW&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.6fzYHJ4vo4y93sOw_CKoNA.k8HZIG7zlPxK4FCWSPXhAC2jMlRLvLdGmQd9-XkPF-I&dib_tag=se&keywords=crispina+and+her+sisters&qid=1734182724&sprefix=crispina+and+her+sisters%2Caps%2C143&sr=8-1&linkCode=ll1&tag=graceandpe03f-20&linkId=3251cc3a9a80d82ec2428caf2e58e2fe&language=en_US&ref_=as_li_ss_tl
Here is Andrew Bartlett’s book, “Men and Women in Christ,” https://www.amazon.com/Men-Women-Christ-Fresh-Biblical/dp/1783599170?crid=36PAYZANZSZCB&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.nhFlq-uL7BTRG55d0yqCBA._LbUOm44oItmarvB1JkTONAP3nuBteoAaatrvZjlI1A&dib_tag=se&keywords=andrew+bartlett+men+and+women+in+christ&qid=1734183925&sprefix=andrew+bartlett%2Caps%2C159&sr=8-1&linkCode=ll1&tag=graceandpe03f-20&linkId=c0ae67666b4016d61b92c4a3dde3107a&language=en_US&ref_=as_li_ss_tl
Maybe God is testing us …. To see if we will stay away from foolish arguments, rather than focusing on the gospel of Jesus Christ, which has the power to save (with Holy Spirit)
Since eternity is for keeps
I’d have to agree. Living our lives devoted to, embodying, and enlivened by Jesus is the focus for every believer, every follower of Christ.
For the Spirit of Christ has been poured out on men and women, enslaved and free, and this is our liberation for all eternity.
This is almost like healing on the Sabbath, all over again …. (Terrible disagreement)
Maybe this is the ideal order of things, but not necessarily a command, and the word for authority was only used once, in that verse
A wrong authority?
A distorted gospel?
And why is it mentioning “deceived”
Which sounds like a false belief for truth
Then the order of things would seem to be inclining – God’s Truth
Not a deceptive gospel that holds no truth
Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life
Knowing Jesus personally
Jesus said not to stop anyone either about serving him ….
And everyone looked down on what the woman did with the perfume before his burial, but not Jesus (this will be remember)
It is one of the more difficult passages in the Christian testament to understand. One idea I have come across that makes a lot of sense to me is that Paul was seeking to correct some bad behavior among some of the leaders in the church at Ephesus, where Paul had left Timothy to pastor and train. Some of the men’s bad behavior came in not controlling their unruly anger. Among the wealthier women, there was an ostentatious display of wealth and status, and that had to stop as well. Heads of household, which could be men or women, had complete rule over their servants, slaves, workers, and various other household members. Some exercised that rule with benevolence, others did not. It seems some of the wealthy, high status women who were leaders were exercising a harsh rule over some men, most likely in their household, and they were also teaching things that were not accurate. Paul wanted these women to learn from Timothy right doctrine and theology before they exercised leadership in the church, and also for their households to be in order.
Paul used a Bible passage to illustrate his intent by talking about the first woman, who was deceived and thereby fell into error. His intimation might have been that these women now, in Ephesus, were also deceived, and that was why they were teaching wrong things. The only way for them to be enlightened was to be in the classroom in all quietness with Timothy as their teacher. “All quietness” here is what Paul would have expected from any student in the classroom, but it might have felt demeaning for people of high status to be under the tutelage on someone who was younger than them and of lower status, which Timothy might very well have been.
The women, Eve, was deceived, indicating she had not been given enough instruction. she was vulnerable. Paul could have been saying, let’s not make that mistake again and leave women without enough instruction.
Paul’s statement about childbirth is also puzzling. Perhaps Paul meant that Eve’s, and all women’s, salvation comes in the birth of Christ. Perhaps Paul as speaking against the prevailing belief in Ephesus that childbirth was more dangerous without the help of certain goddesses.
In all of this, Paul’s main instruction was to command Timothy to teach the women, than they were to learn everything and not be left out because to desire to be a leader in Christ’s cause is to want a good thing (1 Timothy 3:1)
This isn’t the only time the enemy tried getting everyone to follow another gospel about Jesus that wasn’t even true …. (some tried to say Jesus had already come back and left them) (or that he was a ghost/Spirit) we still don’t know exactly what the temple of Artemis was teaching …. And shouldn’t it line up with other scriptures, if this verse had any real consequences ….. There’s not …. And I really don’t think the Spirit of God is making this a Law (or a sin that leads to death)
Should mainly be more concerned about the Lord’s command: love others
And love has no greater than this: that he/she lay down his life for his brethren/sisters (body of Christ)
His bride is what’s important
And are you keeping ready
Are you keeping watchful for his return
Are you ready, if he came back now
And are you getting people ready
He will tell the goats to depart from him
Because THEY DIDN’T LISTEN when he commanded his church to love others ….
Why would anyone want to BLOCK out the gospel from a woman teaching the truth
It just doesn’t even make sense
And God can destroy logic I’m completely aware of that (that God would support this one and only verse in the entire bible and create division and not support it, in other books of the gospels)
It may just be more of what God would prefer in teaching as head of the church (not necessarily completely forbidden)
And notice how it doesn’t say teaching in other trades (does this include them, as well?) But everyone assumes it’s the church with no reference, once so ever, in the entire book, even though rightly so ….
It’s most likely about a false gospel JUST LIKE OTHERS CAME TO THE CONCLUSION OF in that specific location and era …..
Or we would of seen it in other books
You have a really good grasp of the troubles the early church was already experiencing
And also Paul going back to GENESIS would also KEEP THE SOURCE of the gospels
Not some false prophet claiming messages from God
Or from a false gospel with no origin
If the Holy Spirit is really saying this: ……
As completely forbidden ….
I don’t want to say anything against this either, out of respect for his authority
But it’s most likely about a false doctrine and being deceived on God’s pre-designed order of scripture ….
Artemis temple was had to do with “idolism” other gospels/teaching, most likely worship of ***ual stuff …. Fornications …. Maybe even adultery (Which leads to where? That those who do these things WILL NOT INHERIT the Kingdom of God) And Idolism worshipping a false goddess
And what do you know Paul is addressing how woman should dress ….
It’s a doctrine CONFRONTING women teachers IN THAT LOCATION DURING THAT ERA in which THE TEMPLE OF ARTEMIS had great INFLUENCE in that region AT THAT TIME
With women priests for Artemis
and you don’t even know if substance abuse was included
It very likely Paul was addressing them
That women should not hold mastery over men
And mentions being deceived …..
Or listening to a lie or doubting God’s Truth
when it has its ORIGIN about Jesus Christ
Without specifically slandering Artemis worship and causing a violent riot, which could lead to serious injury
There was
The temple of Artemis
&
Women priests
&
False spiritual teaching
So this too Carries weight when considering this verse …. In which you should see at least once more, in another book, if women are really forbidden to teach, as head of the church …. And there isn’t …. BECAUSE OF THE LOCATION, ERA, AND SPIRITUAL INFLUENCING (dressing modestly)
I think you have a really good idea here, this very well could have been the whole thrust of what Paul was writing to Timothy about. It was -not- about silencing all women everywhere for all time, that is certain, because Paul welcomed the voices of women teachers and evangelists, and he even planted churches in women’s homes, where there woman, like Lydia, was head of household.
Also came across verse 15 in this chapter which is sending the message about child-birth and women being saved in this manner
Which goes against the gospel message of salvation (which comes from Jesus alone) and lined up appropriately with the entire gospel message (would involve repentance)
The translated word for child-bearing has a very special word “referring to Christ-birth”
The Artemis Temple (idol worship) religion DID INVOLVE SAFE PREGNANCY and even gifts to Artemis and even christians in that era and that location WERE VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THIS AND WERE EVEN GETTING INVOLVED IN IT (woman could die or even the baby)
So this verse 15 is specifically addressing this VERY PRACTICE “again”
The Adam was created first and then Eve seemes more like addressing “APOLLO” which which happens to be “ARTEMIS” younger twin brother and SIGNIFYING WOMAN AUTHORITIVE DOMINANCE OVER THEIR MALE COUNTER PARTS
and Corinthians or 2 Corinthians doesn’t have anything to do with “AUTHORITY” in the church
This is only mentioned one time AND VERSE 15 really points to “CHRIST” doctrine being the only teaching for SALVATION and CONTRARY to ARTEMIS BELIEF SYSTEM which is IDOLATRY that addresses the PRACTICE OF SAFE PREGNANCY
Now if you rightly dividing the word of truth
(which also has a special translation) referring to PLOWING AND CUTTING straight lines, not crooked or uneven lines THAT OVERLAP INTO EACH OTHER and getting results such as salvation comes only from Jesus and you may keep on sinning (which is false)
It does say to stay away from foolish arguments which end up in godless quarreling
and not to backbite on people inappropriately which would make you unclean before God if unrepentant
It also say God will defile-destroy those who defile-destroy his temple REFERRING TO DISMANTLING OR DESTROYING MEMBERS OF HIS CHURCH (in context)
(Which shows God’s GREAT love and patients towards repentant sinners such as Paul)
Thank you for your thoughtful processing of what was happening in Ephesus during this time, and the reminder that Paul was writing to Timothy, who was then in Ephesus as a teacher and leader. Understanding the historical and cultural context makes it possible to understand what Paul was explaining.
RIGHTLY DIVIDING the word of truth is a word that was originally tied to PLOWING,
Not to make crooked or uneven lines, so that they do not overlap into each other
SO THAT the seed doesn’t show up in an unintended row OR BECOME OUT OF PLACE
and distort the truth
WHICH ONLY COMES THROUGH JESUS CHRIST
I didn’t know that about they etymology of “rightly diving,” thank for that, it’s sensible and illustrative of what teachers of any subject would want to do, and most especially of sacred texts.
And the fact that God would destroy-defiles someone who destroys-defiles his church shows, that God cares very much about his church
Which can occur through through backbiting and Godless quarreling or even mis-information through false-doctine OPPOSED/AGAINST what Jesus instructed
And for even further clarification the book of 2 John says to not even associate with people who PURPOSEFULLY DISTORT the gospel truth and do not encourage them or even welcome them into your home
Which is doing what?
Being opposed to God’s teachings-instructions that help us and others choose life which is a type of anti-christ which simply means to be opposed to Jesus Christ (authority)(King of Kings and Lord of Lord’s)
I write about this in my series on John’s letters: https://graceandpeacejoanne.com/2021/08/31/2-john-keep-in-step-with-christ/